Curse

Thorondor Port · Feb 15, 2008, 09:10 AM // 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by erk

In order to have 7 Heros you would have to change the design of the user interface for the inventory and the skills panels, and probably many other things we don't know about that happen behind the scenes. That sounds like a lot of work and I seriously doubt that A.net would pull staff of GW2 development to do that.

I made a screenshot with 7 heroes bars. Its posted somewhere on this site. Its quite busy and really takes away alot of screen.

If you had 7 heroes bars up on a 800x600 monitor it would be almost impossible to manage them while being able to see what youre even fighting against.

odly · Feb 15, 2008, 10:36 AM // 10:36

You don't have to manage them all all the time. Just micromanage those who need it at a certain moment.

Being able to set up 7 skill bars the way you want would allready be nice.
Getting 7 flags would be a next step.
Being able to micromanage them the one after that.
Being able to use PvE only skills on heroes would be the next one.

Being able to use your own other characters as heroes and switch the primary focus to them (the character you were playing would then become a hero) would be the final step.

VinnyRidira · Feb 15, 2008, 01:24 PM // 13:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

You don't have to manage them all all the time. Just micromanage those who need it at a certain moment.

Being able to set up 7 skill bars the way you want would allready be nice.
Getting 7 flags would be a next step.
Being able to micromanage them the one after that.
Being able to use PvE only skills on heroes would be the next one.

Being able to use your own other characters as heroes and switch the primary focus to them (the character you were playing would then become a hero) would be the final step.

Sheer luxury, even then the Factions Only or Prophecies Only players could have "heroes".

Abedeus · Feb 15, 2008, 01:32 PM // 13:32

Yeah, and people without Factions should get Alliance Battles and people without prophecies should get access to Pre-Searing or Sorrow's Furnace.

But at least people against it have the biggest argument void.

,,7 heroes would be too easy!''

It can't be easier than with 5 ursans and 3 monks. Or any other combination with Ursan.

Crom The Pale · Feb 15, 2008, 01:45 PM // 13:45

As for screen clutter now that we have quick keys for all our heros we can eliminate all of the Hero skill bars from our screens.

Not to mention the simple fact that giving them the correct skillbars means they will act better than hench and micro-managing really won't be an issue unless your runing a massively integrated party build that requires each char to use a certain skill at a certain time on a certain target---if that is the case can you think of a better learning tool for GvG than giving us 7 heros????

mage767 · Feb 15, 2008, 02:34 PM // 14:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

You don't have to manage them all all the time. Just micromanage those who need it at a certain moment.

Being able to set up 7 skill bars the way you want would allready be nice.
Getting 7 flags would be a next step.
Being able to micromanage them the one after that.
Being able to use PvE only skills on heroes would be the next one.

Being able to use your own other characters as heroes and switch the primary focus to them (the character you were playing would then become a hero) would be the final step.

Nice, I thought along the same lines as you - and in fact, your last point is exactly what I told my guildies once. The ability to bring your exisiting characters (not the one you are playing in) as "heroes" would be extremely amazing. Heck, I would even stick with 3 "heroes" if I could bring my 3 other characters with elite black armor/sun glasses/....lol

Ofcourse, I don't see that getting implemented, but 7-heroes idea is highly reasonable for hard-mode, so that people without GW:EN and who don't have consumables or the dam URSAN have a better chance at maxing the Guardian/Vanquisher titles. The game is unbalanced as of now, and people without GW:EN are left an outcast, making it difficult for them to join Ursan-based-mindless-killing hard-mode-made-easy PvE groups.

BTW, I do own GW:EN and all other GW packs.

Splitisoda · Feb 16, 2008, 01:28 AM // 01:28

I figured out a "possible" problem with 7 heroes. I'm not sure if this is possible ,but maybe a single person will go and try to do GVG's with 7 heroes and lose on purpose to lower a rival guilds rank down/up(whichever is worse)

Isileth · Feb 16, 2008, 01:53 AM // 01:53

7 heroes would not be allowed in PvP.

There is already a limit on the number of AI you can take into PvP, that wouldnt be changed.

7 heroes would only effect PvE.

Bryant Again · Feb 16, 2008, 01:56 AM // 01:56

Having 7 hero teams go against each other in a skirmish would be awesome, though : )

Shadowlance. · Mar 21, 2008, 03:50 PM // 15:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

Being able to use your own other characters as heroes and switch the primary focus to them (the character you were playing would then become a hero) would be the final step.

I'd had that same thought too - this would be awesome, but I hold out really no hope at all that we'll ever see it. It's one of those "if I could design the next GW" ideas I often think about.

Sadly, many builds that work well for a player don't work very well with hero AI without a high amount of micromanagement. With 7 heroes I think I'd tend to lean toward builds that the AI can handle by themselves. This would take some of the fun away from switching the focus over to those characters.

To mitigate that, here's another idea that will likely never see the light of day: If we had the ability to switch focus and play as our other party characters, naturally the AI would take over for the player we just left. It would be cool if the AI could "watch and learn" over time how we use a certain build. For example, what order we usually use skills, which stances/enchants we try to always keep up, etc. Then when the AI takes over, it would do its best to mimic that behavior.

zwei2stein · Mar 21, 2008, 04:04 PM // 16:04

I would like to point out that "interface clutter" is nonissue:

People want competent skill bars and equipment from heroes. Flag and Minibar is luxury, 4 extra heroes could exist without GUI aditions, and you don't usually even have reason and desire micro more than 3 heroes.

Anyone running 3+3 heroes can tell you that.

Besides, word is, anet experimented with 7 heroes, so gui work was already done.

tmr819 · Mar 21, 2008, 04:17 PM // 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

I would like to point out that "interface clutter" is nonissue:

People want competent skill bars and equipment from heroes. Flag and Minibar is luxury, 4 extra heroes could exist without GUI aditions, and you don't usually even have reason and desire micro more than 3 heroes.

Anyone running 3+3 heroes can tell you that.

Besides, word is, anet experimented with 7 heroes, so gui work was already done.

Agreed. The four "hench"-style Heroes would simply function like the current henchmen, on autopilot, only with the skill sets and weapons, etc., you had given them before leaving the outpost. No accessible skill bars or flags needed.

As the GW1 population continues to thin, I would really love to see an idea like this implemented. It would infuse a new level of fun into the game, imo.

Splitisoda · Mar 21, 2008, 04:21 PM // 16:21

I would really, I mean, you have to spend extra money on those heroes, so it may help keep the economy in balance seeing as you'll probably want your heroes as UBERPWNZERSWTF as possible.

Personally, I ALWAYS H/H everything. I take myself, 3 heroes, and 4 henchies. And I still normally pass through the mission, and if i had 7 heroes, well lets just say 2 support rits, 3 MMS , 2 monks, and a SY! Para will be pretty WTFPWNED?

Stolen Souls · Mar 21, 2008, 04:22 PM // 16:22

I would love to see this. It'd be fun to come up with different teams, etc.

As was mentioned already, the "it'd make PvE too easy" argument means nothing anymore because of one word...Ursan. PvE can NOT get any easier or more unbalanced than that.

Even if the last four heros functioned the same way henchies do, it'd still be interesting.

Shadowlance. · Mar 21, 2008, 04:59 PM // 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stolen Souls

As was mentioned already, the "it'd make PvE too easy" argument means nothing anymore because of one word...Ursan. PvE can NOT get any easier or more unbalanced than that.

I 100% agree. If heroes continue to not be able to use PvE-only skills, than having 7 heroes is not at all imbalanced as compared to a team of Ursan human players.

Anet... Gaile... if you're reading this thread, please consider 7 heroes to be one of the "most requested" features from your gaming community. I know you've already said PvE is not designed or balanced for 7 heroes, but I believe we in this thread have proven why that is not the case.

Loviatar · Mar 21, 2008, 05:10 PM // 17:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadowlance.

Anet... Gaile... if you're reading this thread, please consider 7 heroes to be one of the "most requested" features from your gaming community. I know you've already said PvE is not designed or balanced for 7 heroes, but I believe we in this thread have proven why that is not the case.

not the community at all

QUOTE JEFF STRAIN NOT GAILE

Quote:

Pay close attention to complexity creep. Don't assume that most of your players are reading your website and consuming information about your game. Most of your players will never read your website, never visit fansites, and never participate in forum discussions. We are often immersed in the community forums and rants and raves posted to game fansites, and it is easy to lose perspective about the knowledge level of most of our players. Players who participate in fansites and send six-page emails to your community team are experts at your game – they probably know more about it than you do – so it's important to realize that they do not represent the average player. The vast majority of your players are not digging into every detail of every spell or creating lists of animations so that they can react when they see the basilisk twitch its nose. They want to play, not study, so take care to create a game that allows them to do so.

many year consistant proven marketing fact not just his opinion.

these sites let alune these threads are not the main playerbase and they already gave a flat no with zero qualifiers on it.

bhavv · Mar 21, 2008, 05:10 PM // 17:10

I already thought too that when Gaile said in LA a few days back that 7 heroes would be imbalanced, how come they allow Ursan?

Anet dont have a clue about balance in PVE, 7 heroes would just make it extremely fun.

Shadowlance. · Mar 21, 2008, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

not the community at all

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

they already gave a flat no with zero qualifiers on it.

I'm sure you're right, but when a person contacts the support team, they always reply back "please use the community forums such as guildwarsguru etc." This really is the only outlet we have to try to communicate with the Anet folks.

Also they may have already said no - that's fine - we're just trying to change their minds. Who knows, they may just relent. As bhavv mentioned above, 7 heroes would be just for PvE, where skills like Ursan have already made it somewhat imbalanced. This is not about balance - it's about fun, and giving the gamers what they want.

Zahr Dalsk · Mar 21, 2008, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

not the community at all

Actually, my questioning people ingame has turned out that most (excluding PuG players, whose opinions don't really matter in this debate anyways) H/H players would like pure 7 heroes.

bhavv · Mar 21, 2008, 06:07 PM // 18:07

Most of the people I talk to ingame would like 7 heroes, around 75%+ of the last two full alliances I have been in (A farmers alliance and a HM alliance).